"Real Love"
April 18th
(Click Photo for Siddhartha)
The following is a Q&A between a Humanities Teacher and myself during April of 2013 at College of the Siskiyous.
Q: According to Siddhartha's perspective at the end of his life, how is human love considered Samsara?
A: Because it is a love that is in the world, and is settled for as real love. However, real love is not between two but what two are IN. It is not dependent on time or space or whether one stays together or leaves, it is not dependent on anything in this world to be and so "love" of a human is Samsara because it is not real. It is limited by beliefs and making sure that one does what the other wants or they with hold the love. True Love cannot be withheld, it does not change or move or alter. This is the difference and why he said human love is Samsara.
Q: And so you see this as Siddhartha's understanding.
A: How could one tell you what Siddhartha's understanding or Herman Hesse's is, for me it is not understanding at all, it is what is before understanding. Understanding is intellectual and where Herman and Siddhartha point from what i read...is what the mind cannot be used for, it is what the mind is IN...I can only see it from how it is seen through here, it is interpreted by the filters that I use to explain what is read.
Q: Yes, you are too right. Siddhartha's understanding is not an intellectual understanding at all. It is beyond that, as is the path of all mystics. According to Siddhartha's realization, what is the nature of wisdom?
A: It is allowing all things to be, to see that life is like the river constantly flowing and the wise know where the river leads, just like all of life is being led there. There is nothing to do for the wise...there is only Knowing.
Q: Okay, yes and again this according to Siddhartha.
A: Again, how could I really tell you what Siddhartha's understanding or Herman Hesse's is...this is what came from what I read and from what has been revealed and as I read Siddhartha, it was just Yes. Like listening to another share the same rememberances.
Q: Aha! What are some of the insights Siddhartha learned throughout his life? List at least three with examples from the book.
A: 1. He learned that he must reliquinsh his family and all he knows to begin to know who he Truly Is.
2. He learned that he could wait, think and fast and this helped him throughout his life when there was nothing and then again when there was so much, it revealed to him once again that too much is too much and sickens the body and weakens the mind.
3. He learned to have human love and to let it go, through both Kamala and their son, where he had to watch his son do all the things that he would have liked to spare him. It was not an easy lesson, but he did let go.
Q: Yes, and all good examples. Does Siddhartha reach enlightenment at the end of the story? What tells you he has or has not?
A: Siddhartha was enlightened all along, it does not matter if one is not aware of the awakeness within them, everyone is awake all one can do is deny it, spiritual searches are just a denial of the Truth that one is already Awake and Aware and need only place the attention on that and not the personality, which is a lie. Yes, Siddhartha became fully Aware that he was not "Siddhartha" but That which Siddhartha appears IN.
The way it is worded is as if Siddhartha could have become enlightened but what is Enlightened is not individual and so the wording makes it false, no one becomes enlightened, all Already ARE, just stop lying. You are That which is Awake.
Q: But how many DO come to this full awareness? And why then, a Path toward such freedom? Yes, it may be we are all enlightened but very few come to a full awareness of this. This is what the question pertains to. Just because one knows that enlightenment is in us all, does not mean all are fully at that level of knowing. So, you see Siddhartha does come to a full awareness of enlightenment by the end of the story.
A: All one need do is begin to question who they are. This does not take travel or study or ritual, you just ask "who am I?" And know that you do not know who you are but that you have spent a lifetime trying to "make" yourself. Now is the undoing of all that work. Who am I? Is the tool one begins to use to pull off the covers of identity and belief. You are not your body, you are not your name, you are not your job, then who are you? If you get bored with asking, ask again, I asked for 10 years and then the light bulb began to Light and Light up and I knew less and less of who I am in the world and more and more of Who I Am. I am not saying it is an easy investigation, but truly the only one worth having and it is available to everyOne. Do not worry about anyone else's enlightment that is just a distraction from your own...this is a very personal endeavor with yourSelf. Only One ever Awakens.
Q: Yes, I see. It does help though for some to see how it comes about. Hesse knew this when creating his novel, Siddhartha ;-) Does Govinda reach enlightenment? What tells you he has or has not?
A: Again I would refer you to the above in that all are already Enlightened, however I know how this is being said and yes he, through his intimate relationship with Siddhartha, recognized the TRUE SELF (not individual) through that recognition, he did not see Siddhartha but the Truth of who ONE IS. His entire relationship with Siddhartha reflects that he has/IS.
Q: Okay, so you see Govinda does reach a fully enlightened state at the end of the story. A worthy contribution to this disucssion, Joy.
A: Govinda doesn't...Self does.
There is no Govinda.
There is no "insert name here" (that is just a name not who you are, but you have believed you are a "Insert Name Here" for a very long time, but just because you believe it doesn't make it so...you are not who you think you are … that is the good news … you have the opportunity to discover who you are...your True Self). Begin to ask who you are, and don't believe the answers that come, write them down, but don't believe them, get to the place where there are no answers to the question "Who?".
Q: Yes. Thank you for sharing this important knowledge behind what appears to be a personality.
A: Because it is a love that is in the world, and is settled for as real love. However, real love is not between two but what two are IN. It is not dependent on time or space or whether one stays together or leaves, it is not dependent on anything in this world to be and so "love" of a human is Samsara because it is not real. It is limited by beliefs and making sure that one does what the other wants or they with hold the love. True Love cannot be withheld, it does not change or move or alter. This is the difference and why he said human love is Samsara.
Q: And so you see this as Siddhartha's understanding.
A: How could one tell you what Siddhartha's understanding or Herman Hesse's is, for me it is not understanding at all, it is what is before understanding. Understanding is intellectual and where Herman and Siddhartha point from what i read...is what the mind cannot be used for, it is what the mind is IN...I can only see it from how it is seen through here, it is interpreted by the filters that I use to explain what is read.
Q: Yes, you are too right. Siddhartha's understanding is not an intellectual understanding at all. It is beyond that, as is the path of all mystics. According to Siddhartha's realization, what is the nature of wisdom?
A: It is allowing all things to be, to see that life is like the river constantly flowing and the wise know where the river leads, just like all of life is being led there. There is nothing to do for the wise...there is only Knowing.
Q: Okay, yes and again this according to Siddhartha.
A: Again, how could I really tell you what Siddhartha's understanding or Herman Hesse's is...this is what came from what I read and from what has been revealed and as I read Siddhartha, it was just Yes. Like listening to another share the same rememberances.
Q: Aha! What are some of the insights Siddhartha learned throughout his life? List at least three with examples from the book.
A: 1. He learned that he must reliquinsh his family and all he knows to begin to know who he Truly Is.
2. He learned that he could wait, think and fast and this helped him throughout his life when there was nothing and then again when there was so much, it revealed to him once again that too much is too much and sickens the body and weakens the mind.
3. He learned to have human love and to let it go, through both Kamala and their son, where he had to watch his son do all the things that he would have liked to spare him. It was not an easy lesson, but he did let go.
Q: Yes, and all good examples. Does Siddhartha reach enlightenment at the end of the story? What tells you he has or has not?
A: Siddhartha was enlightened all along, it does not matter if one is not aware of the awakeness within them, everyone is awake all one can do is deny it, spiritual searches are just a denial of the Truth that one is already Awake and Aware and need only place the attention on that and not the personality, which is a lie. Yes, Siddhartha became fully Aware that he was not "Siddhartha" but That which Siddhartha appears IN.
The way it is worded is as if Siddhartha could have become enlightened but what is Enlightened is not individual and so the wording makes it false, no one becomes enlightened, all Already ARE, just stop lying. You are That which is Awake.
Q: But how many DO come to this full awareness? And why then, a Path toward such freedom? Yes, it may be we are all enlightened but very few come to a full awareness of this. This is what the question pertains to. Just because one knows that enlightenment is in us all, does not mean all are fully at that level of knowing. So, you see Siddhartha does come to a full awareness of enlightenment by the end of the story.
A: All one need do is begin to question who they are. This does not take travel or study or ritual, you just ask "who am I?" And know that you do not know who you are but that you have spent a lifetime trying to "make" yourself. Now is the undoing of all that work. Who am I? Is the tool one begins to use to pull off the covers of identity and belief. You are not your body, you are not your name, you are not your job, then who are you? If you get bored with asking, ask again, I asked for 10 years and then the light bulb began to Light and Light up and I knew less and less of who I am in the world and more and more of Who I Am. I am not saying it is an easy investigation, but truly the only one worth having and it is available to everyOne. Do not worry about anyone else's enlightment that is just a distraction from your own...this is a very personal endeavor with yourSelf. Only One ever Awakens.
Q: Yes, I see. It does help though for some to see how it comes about. Hesse knew this when creating his novel, Siddhartha ;-) Does Govinda reach enlightenment? What tells you he has or has not?
A: Again I would refer you to the above in that all are already Enlightened, however I know how this is being said and yes he, through his intimate relationship with Siddhartha, recognized the TRUE SELF (not individual) through that recognition, he did not see Siddhartha but the Truth of who ONE IS. His entire relationship with Siddhartha reflects that he has/IS.
Q: Okay, so you see Govinda does reach a fully enlightened state at the end of the story. A worthy contribution to this disucssion, Joy.
A: Govinda doesn't...Self does.
There is no Govinda.
There is no "insert name here" (that is just a name not who you are, but you have believed you are a "Insert Name Here" for a very long time, but just because you believe it doesn't make it so...you are not who you think you are … that is the good news … you have the opportunity to discover who you are...your True Self). Begin to ask who you are, and don't believe the answers that come, write them down, but don't believe them, get to the place where there are no answers to the question "Who?".
Q: Yes. Thank you for sharing this important knowledge behind what appears to be a personality.
